John Stuart Mill and omnipotence
Castle Conwy, Wales 2001
Reformatted: November 30, 2021, original 2009
John Stuart Mill (1806-1873)
Blackburn states Mill is ‘the most influential liberal thinker of the nineteenth century.’[1] He is the son of Scottish philosopher James Mill (1773-1836).[2] George W. Carey (2002) writes that John Stuart Mill reasoned that traditional Christianity needed to be replaced[3] and Mill introduced a concept of a ‘limited God.’[4] Mill reasons there is a ‘final cause’ that appears to be God working within the natural order,[5] but this God was not omnipotent and had limited powers that were incapable of bringing about the full reality of what God wanted.[6] Mill within Theism from 1833 explains that there could be no real belief in a ‘Creator and Governor’ until humankind had begun to understand the confused phenomena which existed around them.[7]
Humanity must bring itself out of the chaos and confusion of reality to have a workable system in able to work out ‘a single plan.’[8] This type of world was anticipated ‘by individuals of exceptional genius’ but could only become true after a long period of scientific examination and thought.[9] Mill desired to replace the God of Christianity with a Religion of Humanity.[10] He reasoned traditional Christianity had been overrated in its promotion of human virtue and morality in society.[11] The Christian God was not the actual creator of the world.[12]
Mill’s views strike me as influential on modern western religious thought. I can support, in limited terms, human effort to understand reality and improve human conditions. Indeed humanity should come together as much as possible to develop a plan in order to benefit all of humanity.
I would not support a ‘Religion of Humanity,’ but do favour persons of various religious and non-religious backgrounds working together for human benefit.
Mill rejects Christianity and traditional Christian doctrine concerning omnipotence. Mill’s deity is similar to the ‘Platonic Demiurge’ and this deity simply develops matter from preexisting chaos and therefore would not only be limited in power but also finite in nature. Mill supports a concept of a first cause[13] as in a series of events[14] but this leaves the nagging question and problem of what was the cause of the Demiurge? An infinite eternal God can be understood as the first cause not needing a cause.[15]
A finite deity, although admittedly logically possible, requires further explanation.[16] If the being is not revealed through Scriptural revelation, it is a God of primarily philosophical speculation and requires further elaboration on the part of Mill in regard to, for instance, why humanity should believe in and follow this type of deity, assuming that there is not a greater, infinite, eternal first cause that would necessarily exist behind that being.
[1] Blackburn (1996: 243).
[2] Blackburn (1996: 243).
[3] Carey (2002: 115).
[4] Carey (2002: 115).
[5] Carey (2002: 115-116). Mill within Theism discusses the need for a cause and beginning to a series of individual facts. Mill (1833)(1985)(2009: 7). Everything persons know of has a cause and owes existence to a cause. He ponders on how the world can be indebted to a cause for which the world has its existence. He deduces ‘that not everything which we know derives its existence from a cause, but only every event or change.’
Mill (1833)(1985)(2009: 10).
[6] Carey (2002: 116). David Gordon writes that Mill believed God was limited in nature and therefore not omnipotent. Gordon (2002: 3).
[7] Mill (1833)(1985)(2009: 6).
[8] Mill (1833)(1985)(2009: 6).
[9] Mill (1833)(1985)(2009: 6).
[10] Carey (2002: 110). In The Utility of Religion from 1874, Mill explains that Christianity offers rewards in the next life for good conduct and the Religion of Humanity would be superior as human virtue would exist for unselfish reasons. Mill (1874)(2002: 16). Although I reason Christians should do what is good and right, just because it is good and right, and not primarily for a possible reward, Mill does not demonstrate in my mind a conclusive argument in how human beings, as they are, can or will ever operate with completely unselfish motives. Is all selfishness wrong, or does some degree of human self-concern and a desire for self-benefit remain an integral part of how God intended humanity to be?
[11] Carey (2002: 114).
[12] Carey (2002: 116). Gordon reasons that Mill was ‘no Christian.’ Gordon (2000: 2).
[13] Carey (2002: 116). Gordon (2002: 3). Mill (1833)(1985)(2009: 10).
[14] Mill (1833)(1985)(2009: 7).
[15] God’s essence is eternal and necessary (logically must exist), and the finite universe is temporal and contingent (not necessary). Shedd (1874-1890)(1980: 191 Volume 1).
[16] Hypothetically, humanity and the universe could have been created by a finite God that was created by another cause.
BLACKBURN, SIMON (1996) Oxford Dictionary of Philosophy, Oxford, Oxford University Press.
CAREY, GEORGE W. (2002) ‘The Authoritarian Secularism of John Stuart Mill’, in On Raeder’s Mill and the Religion of Humanity, Volume 15, Number 1, Columbia, University of Missouri Press.
GORDON, DAVID (2000) ‘John Stuart Mill on Liberty and Control’, in The Mises Review, Volume 6, Number 1, Auburn, Alabama, Ludwig Von Mises Institute.
MILL, JOHN STUART (1833)(1985)(2009) Theism: John Stuart Mill, The Collected Works of John Stuart Mill, Volume X - Essays on Ethics, Religion, and Society, Toronto, University of Toronto Press.
MILL, JOHN STUART (1874)(2002) The Utility of Religion, London, Longman, Green, and Reader.
SHEDD, WILLIAM G.T. (1874-1890)(1980) Dogmatic Theology, Volume 1, Nashville, Thomas Nelson Publishers.
WAINWRIGHT, WILLIAM J. (1996) ’Demiurge’, in Robert Audi, (ed.), The Cambridge Dictionary of Philosophy, Cambridge, Cambridge University Press.
Blackberry photos: September 2009
Very nice pics on your blackberry!! We never got a campfire this summer yet...i hope there is still time!! :()
ReplyDeleteWell, Dean and Anjela never had one in the backyard at either Surrey or Abbotsford.
ReplyDeleteThank you very much, Sherry.
Those photos from the blackberry are better than most cameras. Rick b
ReplyDeleteWell stated, thanks, Rick.
ReplyDeleteI do believe you are having fun taking pictures. The photos are great - I didn't know this place had so much beauty until you see it in picture. This world, created by God, is pretty fabulous!
ReplyDeleteThis condo complex is a pretty nice place for me, for awhile.
ReplyDeleteThanks.:)
Now I'm glad you said that. All I want is to say interesting things on my blog.
ReplyDeleteThank you!
You are welcome, Aline.
ReplyDeleteWhen a person rejects the Scripture as the inspired and inerrant Word of God, then he is confined to his own "wisdom" and God becomes little more than a glorified human being. At least Mormonism went all the way with this idea.
ReplyDeleteYou sound like you may be sympathetic to Kuyperian social theology. For him and those who follow in his footsteps (Wolterstorff, C. Plantinga, Wohler, GGM :-), etc.), human beings are not only created as image-bearers to be in "harmony" with one another such that we seek one another's good and well-being, but we're also created to be in "harmony" with the created order itself such that we live responsibly in this creation, cultivating it for its own flourishing as well. The concept of Shalom is the paradigm of God's intent for His creation; a reality that will one day be fulfilled when Christ returns.
Because of the New Life that we've been given in Christ and by the power of the Spirit, we should be the people who actually live the reality that you say here: "Indeed humanity should come together as much as possible to develop a plan in order to benefit all of humanity. I would not support a ‘Religion of Humanity,’but do favour persons of various religious and non-religious backgrounds working together for human benefit."
I like to think of myself as a "Christian Humanist". When we understand the design and purpose of God for humanity, we will eagerly seek the good of our fellow human beings (beginning with salvation, but not confined to it) and we will seek to cultivate "Shalom" in this world.
GGM
Love the pics!
Hey, nice photos, nice place!
ReplyDelete'When a person rejects the Scripture as the inspired and inerrant Word of God, then he is confined to his own "wisdom" and God becomes little more than a glorified human being. At least Mormonism went all the way with this idea.'
ReplyDeleteWell stated.
'human beings are not only created as image-bearers to be in "harmony" with one another such that we seek one another's good and well-being, but we're also created to be in "harmony" with the created order itself such that we live responsibly in this creation, cultivating it for its own flourishing as well.'
Reasonable.
Christians need to be concerned with both God and humanity (Matthew 22 and Mark 12).
Cheers, Tandy.:)
ReplyDeletei love ur pics ^_^ cool and calming...
ReplyDeleteYes, and that is needed in life.
ReplyDeleteCheers,
Russ
re: im just confused. there are things i want to post but dont want to be read ...
ReplyDeleteReasonable.:)
ReplyDeleteHey Russ,
ReplyDeleteJohn Stuart Mill reasoned that traditional Christianity needed to be replaced...
well that will never happen if the foundation of traditional Christianity is based upon the words Of Jesus.. for even Jesus said in Mt. 24:35 Heaven and earth shall pass away but my words shall not pass away!
great pics.. you live in a beautiful area :)
Thanks, Tamela.
ReplyDeleteThose such as Mill would deny the exclusive truth of the gospel via the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
Russ:)
The trouble with me is a Robbie William's song :)
ReplyDeleteUnderstood.
ReplyDeleteHey, our profile images are included in the full URL version of an article now.
Russ:)
As you state, Mill's thinking is limited, and reflects a common attitude among many today. Don't think too deeply, just enough to get a reasonably sounding philosophy that happens to fit your personal values...
ReplyDeleteCool fan-made Green Lantern trailer
ReplyDeleteWell-reasoned, Saint Chucklins of Maple Ditch.
ReplyDeleteThough this is off-topic, the latest court hearing for Rifqa Bary in Orlando, FL (the 17-year-old girl who fled from Ohio to Florida to keep from getting murdered by her Muslim dad when he found out she became a Christian) was yesterday, and I wanted to post a few links with info regarding this. She needs much prayer. As she herself said, this is not about her. It is spiritual warfare, and the decision of this court will have widespread and long-lasting ripple affects that will affect other cases regarding Islam, honor killings, and killing for apostasy in the United States. It will also be an indicator of the level of dhimmification of the West, and specifically the U.S.
ReplyDeleteFirst, I wanted to mention that I have seen some people on various sites and discussion boards asking if Rifqa Bary could ask for emancipation as a minor. But, unfortunately, from expertlaw.com:
Ohio has no emancipation law. Neither a minor (< 18) nor the minor's parent is able to file a petition for emancipation.
A minor can achieve independence from a parent in two ways:
1. Lawful marriage; or
2. Successful enlistment in any branch of the Armed Forces.
Second, I wanted to mention that 'Al Taqqiyah' is the technique of deception to advance the cause of Islam. It is part of the Jihad strategy of deceiving unbelievers by any means. Islam mandates deception [taqiyya] when Muslims deal with non-Muslims. Muslims are allowed to lie to unbelievers if the lie is for the protection of Islam or the furthering of Islamic goals and objectives. In the cause of Islamic expansionism, Muslims falsely inform non-Muslims that: Islam is a "religion of peace", the Quran mandates pluralism of religions, "jihad" is only about an "inner spiritual struggle", unprovoked violence against non-Muslims is un-Islamic, immigrant Muslims wish to fully integrate into Western countries by adopting democratic principles instead of Sharia Law, Muhammad was a man of peace, etc. None of these things are true. Taqiyya is not about truth. Taqiyya is about deception -- lulling Western people into a false sense of security, while, in reality, Islam directs Muslim immigrants to "appear integrated" while actually living as a state-within-a-state...until they take over. (Europe, beware!)
Rifqa Bary Hearing Yesterday
Rifqa Bary Death Threat: Exhibit A, The Document: FATWA (Death Penalty) for Apostasy
Two Statements on the Punishment of the Apostate According to Islamic Law
Taqiyya
ReplyDeleteI have heard of this general concept from Christian missionaries to Muslims.
'First, I wanted to mention that I have seen some people on various sites and discussion boards asking if Rifqa Bary could ask for emancipation as a minor. But, unfortunately, from expertlaw.com:
Ohio has no emancipation law. Neither a minor (< 18) nor the minor's parent is able to file a petition for emancipation.
A minor can achieve independence from a parent in two ways:
1. Lawful marriage; or
2. Successful enlistment in any branch of the Armed Forces.'
Good information.
Much appreciated, Jeff.
Wow, Russ, I never realized there were so many trees and so much grass where you lived. For some reason, I imagined more of a concrete jungle. I thought you were in the middle of a big city, with 'nary a tree in sight, and very little grass around. The conception that was created in my mind from whatever impression I had was obviously not the reality.
ReplyDeleteThanks, Jeff.
ReplyDeleteInteresting perspective.
I live in Greater Vancouver.
From:)
Metro
'The City of Vancouver had a population of 578,041 in 2006 ( up fr. 545,671 in 2001) [Census data from Statistics Canada www.statscan.ca] in an Land area 114.67 square kilometers. The Province of British Columbia's total population was 4,113,487 (up fr. 3,907,738 in 2001) spread over an area of 926,492.48 square kilometers.
The Greater Vancouver Regional District had a population of 2,116,581 in 2006 (up from 1,986,965 in 2001).'
I live in Maple Ridge which is not in Vancouver proper but is the eastern most part of the north side of Greater Vancouver.
Maple Ridge, like Greater Vancouver and British Columbia is known for being quite green. I like this about Florida as well.
I live upstairs from my disabled Mom in a 55+ condo complex, which is within an association of complexes. I will do this until I have my theology career at work. The area has its nice green areas. I am much younger that 55+, but my Mommy is not.:) I stay and help her out, as she assists me.
Sadly, up the hill is downtown Maple Ridge and the drug addicts and prostitutes.
Russ:)
Maple Ridge, like Greater Vancouver and British Columbia is known for being quite green. I like this about Florida as well.
ReplyDeleteYeah, some of the photos almost look like they could be in Florida.
Sadly, up the hill is downtown Maple Ridge and the drug addicts and prostitutes.
Reminds me of Miami. For a while, I worked in Downtown Miami, and there were plenty of homeless people, winos, drug addicts, areas that smelled like urine, etc., among the many stores and buildings. And of course prostitutes, which were much more prevalent at night. I suppose any big city will highlight the sinfulness of man, though today, the sinfulness of man can be seen even in small towns, as you hear of murders and other crimes even in small towns and rural areas. No matter where you go today, it seems, you will find crime. It's hard to escape it anymore. I moved from Miami to Dunnellon and then to Ocala, and I thought I had seen the last of crime. But in my house in Ocala, someone tried to kick in my front door a while back. When I lived in Miami (for most of my life), I experienced people holding guns and knives on me, and I heard gunshots at night from people shooting at the police, etc., but I never had anyone try to kick in my front door. Last night on TV, they showed this guy who had at least 4 security cameras on his home, because a year ago someone tried to kick in his front door, and because of the $1000.00 or so he had invested in security cameras, they were able to identify and catch the two black men who had broken into his home (thankfully, while he and his family were away) by breaking a window, and had come into his home looking for things to steal. The robbers even saw the cameras, but that did not stop them. One of them even reached up and turned one of the cameras away, but in doing so, the camera caught a close-up of his face! LOL! I don't have the money to invest in security cameras, but if I ever do get the money, I am going to think about doing just that.
You're not the luckyer guy in the world with your luggages!! rs rs.
ReplyDeleteThanks, Jeff.
ReplyDeleteParts of Florida sound violent like Manchester when I lived there.
Maple Ridge is not yet that violent but may head in that direction.
The Lower Mainland and Florida have moisture in common, seems to me, although Florida is generally much warmer.
True, Aline, and I have also been stuck at Toronto/YYZ airport for 5 hours and Ottawa/YOW airport for 8 hours.
ReplyDeleteI bought a t-shirt at YOW...
Okay, my Mom emailed this to me:
ReplyDeleteSubject: Fw: Fridays in Hell
Fridays in Hell
One day a guy died and found himself in hell. As he was wallowing in despair, he had his first meeting with a demon.
The demon asked, 'Why so glum?'
The guy responded, 'What do you think? I'm in hell!'
'Hell's not so bad,' the demon said. 'We actually have a lot of fun down here. You a drinking man?'
'Sure,' the man said, 'I love to drink.'
'Well, you're gonna love Mondays then. On Mondays all we do is drink. Whiskey, tequila, Guinness, wine coolers, diet Tab and Fresca. We drink till we throw up and then we drink some more!'
The guy is astounded. 'Damn, that sounds great.'
'You a smoker?' the demon asked.
'You better believe it!'
'You're gonna love Tuesdays. We get the finest cigars from all over the world and smoke our lungs out! If you get cancer, no biggie. You're already dead, remember?'
'Wow, the guy said, 'that's awesome!'
The demon continued. 'I bet you like to gamble.'
'Why yes, as a matter of fact I do.'
'Wednesdays you can gamble all you want. Craps, blackjack, roulette,
poker, slots, whatever. If you go bankrupt, well, you're dead anyhow.
You into drugs?'
The guy said, 'Are you kidding? I love drugs! You don't mean .. . .'
'That's right! Thursday is drug day. Help yourself to a great big bowl of crack, or smack. Smoke a doobie the size of a submarine. You can do all the drugs you want, you're dead, who cares!'
'Wow,' the guy said, starting to feel better about his situation, 'I
never realized Hell was such a cool place!'
The demon said, 'You gay?'
'No.'
'Ooooh, you're gonna hate Fridays!'
The end
Evil is fun many times.
Until it is done against thee.
There is a theological lesson to be had.
Great pictures of your living space! Your part of the world looks very inviting and very warm and sunny in the summer time!
ReplyDelete-Hick Pics-
Hey thanks, but are you related to John Hick?
ReplyDeleteI love listening to rock too! Do you know tokio hotel? I'ts very nice.
ReplyDeleteThanks, Aline.
ReplyDeleteI listened to a bit of them on You Tube after you mentioned them, but had not heard them before, that I know of.
Russ:)
You would love visiting South America!!
ReplyDeleteAgreed.;)
ReplyDeleteThank you for a very informative and well-written blog. I appreciate your thinking.
ReplyDeleteBest,
Judith Acosta
www.wordsaremedicine.com
Thanks very much, Judith.
ReplyDeleteRuss