Wednesday, June 27, 2012
A Problem of Suffering
Automne, France (trekearth)
June 30, 2012
A homecare worker arrives at this condo this morning and my Mom answers the door downstairs. I often do this for her as my Mom is disabled and deaf, even though I live upstairs, but I slept in this morning. I hear the worker state paraphrased, 'Are you alone today, is your grandson not here'?
At a restaurant a few years ago a waitress asked if I was taking grandma out.
June 27, 2012
Introduction
Listening to philosopher Gary Habermas online from time to time on his website, one of the interesting things he states and I am paraphrasing is that theistic disbelief and objections, and therefore it can be deduced, disbelief in and objections to Christianity are often primarily from negative emotional reactions to suffering, life and to concepts of God.
Gary Habermas
Granted there are philosophers and like that do have philosophical differences with theism and Christianity and I have read several of them, especially in United Kingdom theses work. I do fully admit that some skeptical and atheistic authors do make some reasonable and good critiques within the theodicy and problem of evil debate. They are often cited on this blog.
Critics
I was reading an academic advice column connected to one of professional associations I am connected to and some persons that studied to a PhD level with evangelical training were now pondering on skepticism and atheism as more likely worldview options than Christianity. Having studied Reformed Christianity, Evangelical Christianity, and atheism in the context of theodicy and problem of evil from 1998 to 2010 I can somewhat understand someone arriving at those types of conclusions having read authors with similar views, but intellectually with my research the more I studied the more I became convinced a Reformed sovereignty theodicy and defence was the most reasonable explanation for the problem of evil, superior to the free will views and soul-making theory.
Besides not having the best explanations within the theodicy and problem of evil discussion I also thought that philosophically, skepticism, agnosticism and atheism failed to adequately deal with the issues of first cause and the problem of origins that would be larger than the problem of evil as they have to do with the basics of existence.
If somehow the Biblical record could be proven false, as in all of the prophets, apostles and scribes could be shown not be of supernatural origin, which I see no good evidence for, deism in my view would still be a more likely philosophical alternative than skepticism, agnosticism or atheism as at least the problems of first cause and origins would be reasonably dealt with.
First Cause
Deism
I have discussed deism previously on this blog and I will present again with edits:
My brief and former academic advisor David. A. Pailin, defines deism as coming from the Latin word deus and parallels the Greek which is theos. Pailin (1999: 148). In modern times deism is used to define a supreme being who is the ultimate source of reality, but does not intervene in the natural and historical processes through revelation or salvific acts. Pailin (1999: 148). Pailin writes that the common use of the term ‘theism’ does not carry the same negative implications. Pailin (1999: 148). He explains that historically deism is not so much a set of doctrines, but a movement, largely British, that became popular in the seventeenth and eighteenth centuries. Pailin (1999: 148). Many within deism will have doubts concerning concepts of supernatural religious doctrines, revelation and the authority of the Bible. Pailin (1999: 148). Pailin notes that some within deism desire to replace Christianity with a more ‘reasonable’ faith, and for others it is an attempt to produce a more ‘reasonable’ version of Christianity. Pailin (1999: 149).
William J. Wainwright explains that deism understands true religion as natural, as opposed to supernatural religion. Wainwright (1996: 188). He writes that some self-styled Christian deists accept revelation although they argue that the content is the same as natural religion. Wainwright (1996: 188). Most deists reject revelation as fiction, but many reason that God has ordained that human happiness is possible through natural means that are universally available. Wainwright (1996: 188). Salvation therefore does not come via divine revelation. Wainwright (1996: 188).
Henry Clarence Thiessen writes that for deism God is present in his creation by his power and not in his being and nature. He has endowed creation with certain invariable laws that he oversees in general terms. Theissen (1956: 74). God has created creatures and left them under invariable laws to their own destiny. Thiessen (1956: 74). For Thiessen, the Christian world-view rejects deism because it accepts that God has revealed himself in creation through divine revelation, has providential control and does at times use miracles within his creation. Thiessen (1956: 75). For Thiessen, a deistic God is not much better than no God at all for humanity. Thiessen (1956: 75).
Thiessen has an reasonable point, if deistic approaches reject a God who intervenes within his creation, then it allows, practically speaking, for human beings to expect to have the same end in life as if there is no God. Wainwright deduces that God has ordained human happiness to all universally, but ultimately how happy can human existence be when physical death is the end result for every person? The meaning of life, human life is not substantially meaningful, if permanently terminated. People lose their consciousness and life accomplishments without everlasting life, and therefore life loses ultimate meaning and happiness does not result. The deist can speculate that God can and perhaps shall provide everlasting life and ultimate continual meaning for life, but this is merely speculation devoid of any historically grounded revelation from God.
Accepting that human nature is corrupt as described in Romans 1-3, it is very unlikely that the problem of evil would ever be solved but rather merely treated by humanity if deism is true (even if Romans was not considered divinely inspired the concept could still be correct). There would at no time be any solution for sin, death, and the problem of evil, since the infinite, omnipotent God would not interfere with his creation and regenerate and change individuals in order to eventually establish a Kingdom of God where the problem of evil does not exist. With a deistic universe seemingly sin, death, and the problem of evil continue to exist as long as humanity does. Deism seemingly does not offer any ultimate solution to the problem of evil.
There would be meaning to creation, but essentially only the creator would take lasting meaning from it.
God Wills and is Aware
In the Biblical book of Job, God as the first cause willingly allows evil for good purposes and with perfectly good motives it can be reasoned. Satanic beings and human beings will evil as secondary causes with wrong motives.
The same could be said of the historical crucifixion story of Christ. God wills the evil event with the perfectly good motives of atonement, resurrection and restoration for his people while satanic beings and persons that kill Christ have sinful motives.
It would seem that Biblically despite the very great suffering persons can suffer, God is aware of it and in fact in an ultimate cause but with good motives. Of course this is not to deny that human sinfulness can play a significant part in suffering as persons can cause suffering upon self and others. This often takes place, obviously.
A Christian theology therefore needs to understand reasonably well that God does participate in personal suffering, even though it does hurt extremely much at times.
Christians are to pray, fellowship, study and act for the good within the context of suffering and the problem of evil.
I conclude that a worldview, including religious, should primarily be determined by philosophical and theological evidences (Scripture being key) within reason, as opposed to being primarily determined from personal events and experiences.
Further:
This seems straightforward but in actuality is probably often quite difficult for many to accomplish. Grace through faith is required which leads to good works. (Ephesians 2). Another aspect of the problem of evil is problems related to suffering.
PAILIN, DAVID A. (1999) ‘Deism’, in Alan Richardson and John Bowden (eds.), New Dictionary of Christian Theology, Kent, SCM Press Ltd.
THIESSEN, HENRY C. (1956) Introductory Lectures in Systematic Theology, Grand Rapids, Wm. B. Eerdmans Publishing Company.
WAINWRIGHT, WILLIAM J. (1996) ‘Deism’, in Robert Audi (ed.), The Cambridge Dictionary of Philosophy, Cambridge, Cambridge University Press.
Cha Grande, Brazil (trekearth)
June 29, 2012
I just saw this story on the news. Stupid move by the coach...
June 29, 2012
Martial Arts 'foolery'
Photos by Saint Chucky Cheese I
Editing by Dr. RNM
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Hello to a Russell from another Russell. Odd how onenames with the same root, same meaning can have two such different individuals. You an man of faith, me an atheist. I often read this blog though seldom, if ever comment. Your writing style is easy to read, humourous at times but always intelligent, thought provoking. The trouble I have is, being very much of the Richard Dawkin's frame of mind, what on earth is Theology? It is surely a study of nothing? And no, I am not being contentious for the sake or provocation. My mother is a devout Christian and I love her dearly (I even forgive all those slaps around the backs of my legs as a child!!). I just do not see how Theology is anything but in reality Mythology. If I sound rude the I am sorry. Not my intention. Please explain.
ReplyDelete'Hello to a Russell from another Russell.'
ReplyDeleteGreetings, Russell, thank you. I have always thought you a good 'bloke', no worries. I think it is good that pleasant critics feel free to comment on here.
I also think it adds credibility to my blog, as in I am not trying to shelter myself.
'Odd how onenames with the same root, same meaning can have two such different individuals. You an man of faith, me an atheist.'
Everyone without 100% information and knowledge, so everyone that is finite, has faith concerning his/her worldview. I have faith and reason, obviously demonstrated on my blogs.
'I often read this blog though seldom, if ever comment. Your writing style is easy to read, humourous at times but always intelligent, thought provoking.'
Cheers. Much appreciated, Russell.
'The trouble I have is, being very much of the Richard Dawkin's frame of mind, what on earth is Theology? It is surely a study of nothing? And no, I am not being contentious for the sake or provocation. My mother is a devout Christian and I love her dearly (I even forgive all those slaps around the backs of my legs as a child!!). I just do not see how Theology is anything but in reality Mythology. If I sound rude the I am sorry. Not my intention. Please explain.'
I am not an expert on Dawkins, but if you read the recent post on the blog ‘Nicene Creed Second Lecture Notes & Dawkins/Dawson Posts’ you will have seen that I have done two twin posts reviewing him on my other blog satire and theology. To be honest I think in my UK theses work I faced more challenging critics such as Flew, Mackie and Phillips that were actual philosophers, not scientists trying to do philosophy. British humanist Blackburn that I quote often would be someone I would hold in higher regard as an actual philosopher. Via his text he was quite helpful in me adapting from theology to philosophy of religion for my UK degrees when needed.
The Dawkins' posts are below and all the best to your family! And you of course. I do scan your fine work.
Dawkins
Dawkins Reprise
As far a theology being a reasonable philosophical academic discipline, my blogs, especially this one, are filled with evidence. Some theology is mythology as there are plenty of religions out there but Biblical Christian theology is historically grounded and philosophically sound when presented correctly.
I take your point that Dawkins is not a philosopher but a scientist but that surely is the point. Without science where would mankind be? I as a diabetic would have died many years ago. i don't think he pretends to be anything other than what he is, not just a scientist but an intelligent, moral and upstanding human.
ReplyDeleteI have no bones to pick with the man you call Jesus nor his followers. How could I have? He spoke such wisdom and even quoted other great, wise men. You have to be honest though there is much within the bible that is vile, twisted and borders on being evil. Yahweh telling Abraham to barbecue his son for one.
I think for me, having belief in Jesus is understandable, commnedable even but any organised church is far to filled with dogma and ritual. As Frank Zappa once said, if you need to talk to God, go direct.
‘I take your point that Dawkins is not a philosopher but a scientist but that surely is the point. Without science where would mankind be? I as a diabetic would have died many years ago.’
ReplyDeleteFrom my reading within academia most legitimate Christian scholars do not place science against religion, theology and philosophy. Now, some radical Christian fundamentalists do, and some that are less educated within the Church, but that is certainly not the position portrayed on my blogs.
‘I have no bones to pick with the man you call Jesus nor his followers. How could I have? He spoke such wisdom and even quoted other great, wise men. You have to be honest though there is much within the bible that is vile, twisted and borders on being evil. Yahweh telling Abraham to barbecue his son for one.
I think for me, having belief in Jesus is understandable, commnedable even but any organised church is far to filled with dogma and ritual. As Frank Zappa once said, if you need to talk to God, go direct.’
The problem is Biblically speaking, we in a sense cannot go to God direct, although we can pray from our human perspective of course, because of sin (Romans 1-6). Therefore we need Christ as the God-man as mediator (Hebrews). Ephesians 1 and Romans 8 point out the need for God to choose persons to be in Christ, in salvation and in the Gospel of John 3, one must be be born again.
Germany-Italy time...
Thank you, Russell.
Do you believe then that people of other faiths are morally inept? That I, amd others like me, who lead a spiritual life but not under any particular flag of faith, are unable to acheive the same results? Surely, if I was to be proven wrong and there is a deity out there that created all things, would he/she care one way or another if I believed in them as long as I followed the same moral path?
ReplyDelete'Do you believe then that people of other faiths are morally inept?'
ReplyDeleteNo, I do not think that a non-Christian is necessarily less moral. All persons are still made in the image of God (Genesis 1:27) and still have qualities of the creator.
'That I, amd others like me, who lead a spiritual life but not under any particular flag of faith, are unable to acheive the same results?'
This from a Biblical Christian perspective is not done by human morality, but by grace through faith as in Ephesians 2.
English Standard Version (ESV)
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.
God would have to elect/save individual persons from sin regardless of their worldview outside of Christ.
Cheers, Russell.
Russ
'Oiee found you in the blogosphere ..
ReplyDeleteAdoreiii your blog ..
I'm following you.
I visit tbm:
http://lidiepaulo.blogspot.com.br
Beijocas: *
Great Night ")'
Dear Lidi from Brasil,
Thank you, and I followed back immediately. Your blog looks good. I shall comment.
Russ:)
Unbelievable how that coach could deliberately trip a kid! Shameful!
ReplyDeleteI like the comment about Job - a book mostly neglected by Christians and the church, who would rather have a God that is like a personal genie, than an independent, sovereign entity. Just like children have trouble understanding the hardships they encounter, sometimes because of their parents' caring concern, we do not see the full picture either.
ReplyDelete'chucky said...
ReplyDeleteUnbelievable how that coach could deliberately trip a kid! Shameful!'
The coach is a very sore winner.
'chucky said...
ReplyDeleteI like the comment about Job - a book mostly neglected by Christians and the church, who would rather have a God that is like a personal genie, than an independent, sovereign entity. Just like children have trouble understanding the hardships they encounter, sometimes because of their parents' caring concern, we do not see the full picture either.'
Suffering is very difficult at times.
God can be a real struggle on a personal level for believers. I state this on a personal level as well.
But objective truth and evidences still need to be sought.
Good nights Dr Russel :)
ReplyDeleteNice to your visit. I took the photos last month, but I'm very proud for them so show them again.
Have a nice weekend!
Thanks :)
Welcome and good night, Miss Winter.
ReplyDeleteThank you for the return comment.:)
Back in the particular statement, your school system said each with their students involved admitted and wrongdoing, accepted the particular consequences and furthermore agreed to successfully let ones fractionnement publicly release some of the terms pertaining to their disciplinary action.
ReplyDeleteSomewhat related, I am familiar with Universities and wrong doing, but that is another article, please check the archives of both of my blogs.
ReplyDeleteGood evening, I have to go check on the pasta I am making for dinner.
Hola Dr Russell, un placer pasar a leer, bellas imagenes e interesante lo que compartes, gracias por dejar tu huella en mi blog. Cuidate.
ReplyDelete'Hi Dr. Russell, a pleasure to spend to read, beautiful pictures and interesting what you share, please leave your mark on my blog. Take care.'
ReplyDeleteWill do, thank you.
A drunk bus driver named Dong copies Miami Cannibal in Chinese city, attempting to eat the face of a woman driver.
ReplyDeleteThere appears to be a worldwide trend in zombie cannibalism as this article suggests.
ReplyDeleteDocumentary on ritual child abuse on the British island of Jersey.
ReplyDeleteFull film available here.
'chucky said...
ReplyDeleteA drunk bus driver named Dong copies Miami Cannibal in Chinese city, attempting to eat the face of a woman driver.'
He drank too much. A world trend of Zombies or more so a media creation? More evidence is needed for the trend angle.
chucky said...
ReplyDeleteThere appears to be a worldwide trend in zombie cannibalism as this article suggests.
‘The recent string of grisly cannibal attacks across the country has incited faux fears that this could be the start of a “Zombie Apocalypse.”
From the naked Miami man who ate the face off a homeless man to the Canadian porn star accused of dismembering and eating his gay lover, the Internet is humming with nutty rumors — the undead have begun to devour the living!
A Centers for Disease Control and Prevention spokesman went so far as to issue a statement — that the “CDC does not know of a virus or condition that would reanimate the dead (or one that would present zombielike symptoms).”’
'chucky said...
ReplyDeleteDocumentary on ritual child abuse on the British island of Jersey.
Full film available here.'
Disturbing. I will watch the film.
Thanks
I think your deductions from your article are accurate and well thought out,
ReplyDeleteit can be deduced, disbelief in and objections to Christianity are often primarily from negative emotional reactions to suffering, life and to concepts of God.
-Article Critique-
Wiki-Scientology
ReplyDeleteWiki-Jersey
ReplyDelete'Anonymous said...
ReplyDeleteI think your deductions from your article are accurate and well thought out,
it can be deduced, disbelief in and objections to Christianity are often primarily from negative emotional reactions to suffering, life and to concepts of God.
-Article Critique-'
Yes, clues are on how much rational philosophical issues are actually adequately dealt with, as opposed to issues more emotionally based.
Much appreciated.
'Scientology beliefs revolve around the thetan, the individualized expression of the cosmic source, or life force, named after the Greek letter theta (θ).[89][90][91] The thetan is the true identity of a person – an intrinsically good, omniscient, non-material core capable of unlimited creativity.[89][90]
ReplyDeleteIn the primordial past, thetans brought the material universe into being largely for their own pleasure.[89] The universe has no independent reality, but derives its apparent reality from the fact that most thetans agree it exists.[90] Thetans fell from grace when they began to identify with their creation, rather than their original state of spiritual purity.[89] Eventually they lost their memory of their true nature, along with the associated spiritual and creative powers. As a result, thetans came to think of themselves as nothing but embodied beings.[90][92]
Thetans are reborn time and time again in new bodies through a process called "assumption" which is analogous to reincarnation.'
Reads like science fiction. No solid philosophical or historical grounding.
Thanks
'Anonymous said...
ReplyDeleteWiki-Jersey'
A good film in that it highlights the abuse and potential for abuse of children. But the satanism connection was not firmly made and the same can be stated for the supposed Masonic connection.
Cheers.
I will be sure to bookmark it and come back to learn extra of your useful info. Thank you for the post. I will certainly return.
ReplyDeleteThank you.
ReplyDeleteGood evening.